Replacing Seats?

Dr. Dave · Post by **Dr. Dave** » Mon Apr 28, 2003 6:14 am

I notice that I seldom use the back seats in my 170B and when I need it, I only need one... Has anyone ever seen a single back seat installed? If so, was it built from scratch or chopped down from the factory double? Would a mod like this be legal with a field approval??

Thanks

Dr. Dave

Post by **GAHorn** » Mon Apr 28, 2003 1:26 pm

There are several back seats that replace the rear bench. Some of them are single-seat. Try Atlee-Dodge, and B.A.S.
A "field approval",is what makes anything you want to do ...legal. The problem is getting the field approval. You'll may be happier to keep your bench for re-installation in the future, and buy an STC'd single rear seat.

Roesbery · Post by **Roesbery** » Mon Apr 28, 2003 3:09 pm

I am in the process of installing individual cessna seats in the rear seat position. They bolt to the side with two bolts and the backs slip into sockets for drop in pull out use. Look around commercial 180-185 operators and you can probably find some examples.

wa4jr · Post by **wa4jr** » Tue Apr 29, 2003 2:26 am

As opposed to the issue with the rear bench seat, which my children find is just fine for them, I have an issue with the front seats. After two trips from the mid Atlantic to San Antonio and back, my wife and I have concluded that although the 170 is quite a nice cross country machine, the original seats are only slightly better than sitting on a couple of concrete blocks! Is it possible to fit later model C-172 high back seats to the 170 for some cross country comfort? The ONLY thing I like about the new production Cessna aircraft are those wonderful seats! I'd like to hear from anyone who has made the switch to late model front seats.

zero.one.victor · Post by **zero.one.victor** » Tue Apr 29, 2003 4:38 am

I recently installed a single Cessna 185 jump seat ("divided middle row seat")in place of the stock bench rear seat. I lucked into finding a used one in not-too-bad shape for $165,including shipping from the other side of the country. The seat required installation of a nutplate at the door post,then you have to buy a seat belt and come up with eyebolts &/or cargo rings for attach points.
Then you have to get it field approved. A certain participant on this discussion board did all the approval legwork & paperwork for me (thanks Kelly!)
It's a lot lighter than the bench seat: about 10 pounds versus 30. Also,more room for cargo & easier access to the baggage area. Plus it looks cool! I always figured the 170 is a marginal 4-place but a good 3-place,so the single rear seat makes sense.
I don't know about Atlee-Dodge,but BAS will sell a single rear seat. The STC for it even includes the 170 models. Only trouble is that it'll set ya back about $825 (or $1550 a pair)--whew! They're really nice,but that's a lot of cabbage!
Regarding the hi-back 172 seats,my 170 had them when I bought it. I hated them--for me,they were very uncomfortable,and ugly to boot. I managed to buy a pair of used stock 170 seats for a hundred bucks,& I like them much better. They look more "right" in a 170,too.
Luckily,the upholstery on these replacement seats doesn't clash too bad with each other,or with the original side panel upholstery.

Eric

Dr. Dave · Post by **Dr. Dave** » Tue Apr 29, 2003 5:00 am

Thanks for all the great ideas..

About the 172 seats.. I would consider getting the original front seats re-upholstered, instead.. Mine were done when I bought it, complete with lumbar support etc.. They are much more comfortable than the originals probably were.. The one Complaint I have with the front seat sytem is that you can't stow much beneath them... I really like the Beach design which has a solid box afair to get the seat at the right height and it is open on the front which makes great stowage.. The seats then run on rails on the box.. not on the floor.. May be a little heavier but was very useful..

Dave

wa4jr · Post by **wa4jr** » Wed Apr 30, 2003 2:55 am

I agree Eric, that the original seats do look more appropriate for the 170. Do you still have those 172 seats? I suppose they fit properly on the stock 170 seat rails? What I am really after is not more padding in the bottom, but the high back to make for more upper body support on the long trips. The stock seats make it impossible to lay my head back for a cat nap while my wife flies, and vice versa...and it is really annoying to doze off and have my head fall back over the top of the low back seat and then jerk awake once again. I'll check some salvage yards and see what I can come up with.

zero.one.victor · Post by **zero.one.victor** » Wed Apr 30, 2003 4:04 am

John,I sold them to a friend of mine who thought he would put them in his 180. That was about 4 years ago,and they're still sitting on the floor of his hangar. I could see if he might want to sell them,if you're interested. I could then put him in touch with you.

Eric

lcranton · Post by **lcranton** » Wed Apr 30, 2003 5:23 am

About 15 years ago I replaced my original Cessna 170 front seats with 1974 Cessna 172 articulating front seats. Should be a simple task given the seat frames fit the C170 seat track, right? Well as in any retrofit endeavor a few obstacles appeared. First, the seat frame hit the fuel selector bezel. No problem made a new reduced diameter fuel selector trim bezel and shortened the fuel selector handle length slightly. Secondly, the 1974 C172 seats have two lock pins, one for each seat rail (C170 has only one seat rail with seat stop pin holes). Submitted 337 to FAA for preapproval of seat installation. 337 indicated removal of one seat stop pin. FAA said I could not modify C172 seat and must use both pins. So I made a fixture to drill the non-drilled rail to accept the additional stop pin. Rail to rail hole alignment alignment is critical as both pins must drop into seat rail holes. Used dye penetrant to check the seat rail for cracks. With seats installed and adjusted to my flying position the high back interfered with the original window latch. Modified window to later Cessna latch and hold open mechanism. Also had to reverse the seat belt attach brackets, inboard to outboard, as the seat would rub when moved fore and aft. FAA field inspected and signed 337. Finally project complete!

Even with all the work the end results are great. Seats can be adjusted (recline and height) to suit personal preference.

If I were to do it over I would try and find the seats from pre-1974 (I think) C172 as they used only one seat lock pin. Also with the seat in the fully lowered position it may still be a little high for a tall person and may need the lower foam cushion modified.

Hope this helps.
Larry

Post by **GAHorn** » Wed Apr 30, 2003 5:31 am

Some 100 series seats will not easily fit a 170 due to the forward doorpost which interferes with the forward/outboard corner of the new seat. It prevents the seat from being able to slide forward sufficiently to install/remove.

funseventy · Post by **funseventy** » Wed Apr 30, 2003 11:03 pm

Regarding upgrading 170 front seats. Jan Stroh in Seattle does a lot of custon seats. She will design the foam cushions around the individual including a nice lumbar support like you find in new vehicles. It isn't free but it will be cheaper and better than replacing the original seats. Remember guys the amount you spend on the co-pilot seat affects how much you're wife flies with you, which in turn affects how long she is supportive to keeping it.

Jan's number is 206 363-4670. This is what she does for a living and she uses all FAA approved goods and the quality is Awesome!!!

Kelly

Bill Venohr · Post by **Bill Venohr** » Thu May 01, 2003 3:10 am

I had looked into Oregon Aero to rebuild my seats--as I recall from a couple years ago, it would run around $1000.00 apiece. That's a little too much support for me.

lcranton · Post by **lcranton** » Mon May 05, 2003 5:16 am

George, You are correct about the seats hitting the fwd door post. I remove my rear seat and then the front seats slide off the track to the rear. A little more work but it has been worth it given the adjustability of the articulating seats. It seems most mods have some sort of compromise.

Larry

170C · Post by **170C** » Tue May 06, 2003 12:14 pm

Dr. Dave, I have been wanting to send you a post on this subject, but delayed due to system problems.
My '56 172-TD had the rear seat cut in half when I purchased it. Although I obtained a regular full sized seat and had it upholstered when I redid the interior in 1989, I did not reupholster it when I again redid the interior in 2001. The rear (stock) seat was modified so only the right hand side remains. The adjustment bar at the top remains as a support/adjustment item. I have not had my full width seat in the plane for many years. Several reasons: My plane is a marginal 4 place unless it is really cool weather & operating off a long, hard surfaced runway. (I operate in Texas off a 2000 ft grass strip.) I saved about 16 pounds of empty weigh and it makes putting items in the baggage area MUCH easier + I can put longer or larger sized items in because they can extend forward to the front of the rear seat area. Also I am not tempted to carry that 4th person. Disadvantages: Can't carry that 4th person. Still have the rear attachment point with the long tube going behind the rear seat. Seat is no doubt still heavier than the BAS fold up seats, but mucho cheaper.

Dr. Dave · Post by **Dr. Dave** » Sat May 10, 2003 3:09 pm

Just a note to thank everyone for all the input.. I have been away for a while so this is a bit late.. Sorry about that.. My present plan is to keep an eye out for an early modle 172 seat and try to modify it to fit in the rt hansd rear position..

Thanks again..

Dave

The International Cessna 170 Association

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