window frame

philnino · Post by **philnino** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 5:47 pm

I noticed on my recent trip to PANC that there was a large number of 170's with both windows able to be opened. Currently, I can only open the driver's side door window but would like to convert the other window to the latch and hinge setup. Is the frame from a 172 the same? I only have manuals for the 170. I do not know if I am interested in the bubble windows or not, any comments welcome. I am out on the road without the ability to study this too hard but am looking for the quick and dirty on this seemingly popular mod. Thanks,

doug8082a · Post by **doug8082a** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 7:47 pm

What year/model/serial number 170 do you have?

The ability to open both windows was factory standard 1948-1955. It was omitted in the 1956 model year. I'm at work, so I don't have my books handy to tell you what the s/n of the change was.

If the s/n of your 170 does not fall within the range of those built in '56 without the opening window, then perhaps your 170 had the door replaced sometime in the past with a door with a fixed window(?).

doug8082a · Post by **doug8082a** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 11:06 pm

OK, got the books. The right door ceased having an opening window beginning with serial number 26996 through the end of the production run. Anything prior to s/n 26996 had windows which opened on both doors.

philnino · Post by **philnino** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 11:58 pm

Do I dare ask about cost and availability? Time to start calling the junkyards. Anyone have recommendations on the bubbles versus the flat? Thanks for the quick reply Doug.
Phillip

Dave Clark · Post by **Dave Clark** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 1:43 pm

One quick way to see if your door might hold an opening window is to look at the top of the frame for the window to see if there are indentations where the hinges would mount. The windows are sided so at least for the outer frame trim pieces you'll need to be sure to get the right ones. It is possible to reverse the inner steel frame but it takes some skill. The latch pieces can be bought from Univair, also sold by Aircraft Spruce.

Harold Holiman · Post by **Harold Holiman** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 12:55 am

Phillip,

My ideas of advantages or disadvantages of flat vs bubble windows. Flat windows can be opened in flight and will fly up against the wing for photography, etc. Bubble windows give you more elbow room and improve downward vizability but must remain closed in flight and cannot be opened in flight. As to your right door not having an opening window, it will probably be less expensive to buy a complete right door with opening window from a salvage yard than it is to rebuild your door to accept an opening window.

Harold
N92CP

trake · Post by **trake** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:18 am

Bubble or domed side windows are dumb. I had them on my plane when I bought it. Theyre draggy, expensive and cause optical distortion and weird reflections and you bump your head on them when youre working around your plane. If you wear a ballcap and or a headset theyre useless. Not that theres anything wrong with that.

philnino · Post by **philnino** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 1:43 pm

Thanks for the info everyone, I am waiting to get home so I can determine what parts I need for the changeout.
Phillip

N170CT · Post by **N170CT** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 8:56 pm

Doug,

Was the Pax Opening Window an option????

My '56 170B has an opening window in PAX door, but the serial number is 27108.

Any ideas/suggestions/comments??

Chuck

cessna170bdriver · Post by **cessna170bdriver** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:32 pm

N170CT wrote:Doug,

Was the Pax Opening Window an option????

My '56 170B has an opening window in PAX door, but the serial number is 27108.

Any ideas/suggestions/comments??

Chuck

Chuck,
Maybe you got Phillip's original door.

As far as I know all C170 doors are interchangeable, and unless a A&P or AI were really familiar with them, it's unlikely a swap would ever be detected. Same is true of the '56 cowlings without an access door on the right side.

dacker · Post by **dacker** » Thu Jun 30, 2005 1:16 am

170 Driver, you just inadvertantly answered a curiosity about my '49 A model. Having been wrecked a few times in it's past life, it has wound up with a different cowl (not to mention the engine and a few other things). It only has an oil access on the left side so I am thinking maybe it is from a '56. Also the engine came from a '56 172 if I am not mistaken, I wonder if the cowl did as well with maybe some modification?
David

doug8082a · Post by **doug8082a** » Thu Jun 30, 2005 1:17 am

From everything I've read, the pax opening window was not an option. It was factory standard up to serial number 26995. From s/n 26996 to the end of the run it was non-opening. Sounds like you had a door replaced once upon a time.

From s/n 26996 on they actually eliminated several things - right hand opening window, right hand cowl access door. Right hand brakes and controls were optional.

cessna170bdriver · Post by **cessna170bdriver** » Thu Jun 30, 2005 4:16 am

dacker wrote: Having been wrecked a few times in it's past life, it has wound up with a different cowl (not to mention the engine and a few other things). It only has an oil access on the left side so I am thinking maybe it is from a '56. Also the engine came from a '56 172 if I am not mistaken, I wonder if the cowl did as well with maybe some modification?
David

Your plane probably got the whole firewall-forward from the 172. I've flown a friend's '56 or '57 172 and without looking out at the gear I would have sworn I was flying a 170.

Miles

philnino · Post by **philnino** » Wed Jul 06, 2005 2:44 am

Hey Chuck,
I'll trade you doors if you want to make your bird hotter in the summer and cooler in the winter

. I'll even let you match the paint

!!!!

I am still having difficulty tracking down parts, I will take any leads, calling Cessna back tomorrow since I never heard back from the local dealer or Wentworth. Would be nice if the parts were interchangeable with a 172...guess I will know soon enough. Thanks again folks,
Phillip

Post by **GAHorn** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 4:38 am

The '56 C-172 is theoretically the same, but final fit/finish is always an issue when purchasing a door from a different airframe and then trying to fit it to yours. It's not quite like buying a starter or prop, etc. Getting that door to close, seal, and operate smoothly can be a challenge, because they are thin, flexible, can warp and need fitment.