New Fuel

[mike roe]

Sounds promising-
http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/news/un ... 740-1.html

[blueldr]

My guess is that the above fuel will be considerly more expensive than the current service station mogas which I have been using for years with absolutely no problems.

[GAHorn]

My guess is that the above fuel will be considerly more expensive than the current service station mogas which I have been using for years with absolutely no problems.

And it's definitely more expensive (and a lot less smelly) than the gas Ol'Gar has been producing for the last decade.

[bsdunek]

The problem is, as I see it, it will be one little refinery making it. That means a lot of transportation costs, especially to the other end of the country. Maybe, other refineries could be contracted to produce it, but with the small volume, I don't think that would help much.

Unfortunately, with the EPA pushing for new fuels again, regular old mogas won't be available much longer.

We'll just wait and see.

[bagarre]

How many plants are making 100LL today?
Transportation may actually be cheaper (maybe) if they can use the same trucks as car gas for fuel delivery.
With lead in our leaded gas, they can't mix trucks. So, avgas requires its own separate fleet for fuel delivery.

But, that would also mean that we'd have to tolerate possible trace amounts ethanol.

[blueldr]

Ethanol seems to be the big bugaboo today, although hundreds (or maybe more) of Rotax operators and a good many Continental and Lycoming operators do not seem to be having any problem with it other than the legality issue.

[bagarre]

And we all know that when it comes to the FAA, legality is much more important that reality.

[GAHorn]

Anyone who's tried to thread a metric nut onto a SAE bolt knows the value of standards.
If that bolt is what holds the surgeons table up, then the relative importance increases somewhat.
In 1970 autogas cost 22 cents and avgas was 45 cents....about double that of mogas, and that mogas had lead in it.
Today's $3.50 mogas is more than half of todays avgas ( I paid $4.95 Monday), so the relationship is actually somewhat better.
I'm not sayin' that's a good thing....I'm just comparin'. I wish mogas was 45 cents. Then I'd probably find it ran just fine in airplanes too....(or at least the difference made the fuel-system repairs affordable!)

I hate ethanol in fuel and what it does to fuel system components.

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

George, you live in a part of the country where AVGAS is cheap. The relation ship of the cost of MOGAS to AVGAS around her has not changed. It is a few cents less than double. Cheap AVGAS around here in a very few spots is $5.95 average is $6.29 and if your not careful $7 easy. MOGAS is $3.52 today.

Filling my 170 tanks is north of $225 which is pretty hard to hide in my budget and why our 170 is only getting about 20 hours flown on it each year.

I don't think we will ever see a new fuel, not at least until our economy collapses and most of the regulations are thrown out and then it will be all new REGULAR ethanol free MOGAS. Of course most of us won't be buying it for our airplane at that point.

And I hate ethanol in any MOGAS in any of my vehicles but I have no choice in my car and lawn equipment. But I don't have to fly my airplane and that is exactly what is happening.

[GAHorn]

I hear ya', Bruce.

(You know, if all you yankees didn't require so much energy to keep warm up there, the prices of energy would be different. Dubya has taken matters into hand and is movin'-on-down!
If more folks like HIM did that...then we'd all be better-able to afford our get-togethers....and real estate prices/values would immediately fall like they did over in Pipe Creek, TX...and we'd all have more money to fly!

[hilltop170]

And I hate ethanol in any MOGAS in any of my vehicles but I have no choice in my car and lawn equipment.

I have used 100LL in all my small engines for over 15 years (and 1950 Pontiac with a 455 HO engine for the last 10 years) without ANY adverse effects. It is much more stable than mogas, does not go bad in a couple of months like mogas, and will not sludge up your engine's fuel system if it stays in the engine over the winter or summer.

What little fuel I use in the small engines does not break the bank. Different story with the Pontiac but its still worth it.

[blueldr]

I have a small (600 W.) generator that I keep around for use during power outages, which are really quite rare today. The fuel, mogas, has been in it for at least 3 years and it still starts on the second pull. So much for mogas going sour in a short time.
When it comes to sour mogas, I have a '63 Ford Convertable that I bought new when I reurned from Guam. It layed dead for about ten or twelve years after my wife passed away. Talk about stinking fuel! When we reactivated it a couple of years ago, you could smell the mess all over the county and I had to have the fuel tank removed and boiled out. Fuel tank job cost $250.00. Two weeks later I got a catalog from an outfit called "Dearborn Classics". They priced a new tank at $250.00. It figures.

[GAHorn]

I finally figured it out. The reason bluElder is still spry and young (at least mentally) is because he and his mogas both exist in a time-warp. There is NO ONE and NO WHERE else that modern mogas doesn't eat small engine carbs and go bad after a few months. I doubt he even has to change his underwear regularly, but I prefer not to dwell on that....

[blueldr]

George,
It's all because of clean living and a pure heart.

[ginbug92b]

I finally figured it out. The reason bluElder is still spry and young (at least mentally) is because he and his mogas both exist in a time-warp. There is NO ONE and NO WHERE else that modern mogas doesn't eat small engine carbs and go bad after a few months. I doubt he even has to change his underwear regularly, but I prefer not to dwell on that....

Not true. One of my hanger tenants (who just died at 91) had a bunch of 5 gallon containers full of auto gas that he used in his Cub stored here. The gas in them was at LEAST 5 years old. I am running it right now in one of my tractors with NO problems whatsoever. bluElder, I've got your back, buddy.